Transcript

Mabel Jiménez  00:06
I want to see community media become not a stepping stone to something else, but like a destination where you can be and you can stay and you can build a career

Mónika  00:17
Bienvenida to Our Latina Lens Podcast, where we delve into the stories and memorable images of U.S.-based Latina photographers. I distinctly remember when I was in elementary school, flipping through National Geographic magazines and dreaming of being a photojournalist. It’s funny because that came up in our interview today, this vision of what a photojournalist is and how that image is actually changing. Today, I speak to Mabel Jiménez. She’s a community photo journalist and editor. She thinks deeply about the role of photojournalists and of the people whose lives their stories impact. We had a great conversation talking about the tensions between old and new paradigms in journalism, and why we should all support our local community papers. I’m really excited to share this interview with you today.

Mónika  01:13
Don’t miss Mabel’s image tour episode that will be released next week, where she takes us behind the scenes of two of her most significant images. Our mission is to elevate the voices of photographers like Mabel, so help us out by sharing this episode and rate and review us on Apple and Spotify. Gracias.

Mónika  01:35
Today we’re chatting with Mabel Jiménez, and she has been an incredible supporter, I met Mabel right before the pandemic we got to meet in person once and that was a beautiful opportunity. And she is known as La Fotógrafa del Pueblo and what a beautiful title. Hi Mabel, welcome!

Mabel Jiménez  01:58
Buenos días Mónika.

Mónika  02:00
Tell us how you came to photography.

Mabel Jiménez  02:02

Ever since I was little I was interested in visuals probably wanted to be a painter or something like that. I ended up just becoming really interested in photography. When I moved from Mexico to the US right before I moved, I just bought myself a little film camera at a flea market. Those first days in the US, the camera was like a way of retaining all these memories that I knew I was like, in this new part of my life exploring new lands. I wanted to save it all. And so that’s that’s how it started, you know. And then as I started finding my way and figuring out what I wanted to study what I wanted to do in college, and professionally, photography and documentation just stayed with me all these years

Mónika  02:48
From that first time that you picked up the camera. Where are you today? Tell us what you do. What genre of photography are you in?

Mabel Jiménez  02:56
21 years after getting a camera at a flea market. I’m a documentary photographer in San Francisco and I’m currently working at an organization called CatchLight. And I am a visual editor for a project that they have called the California desk. CatchLight is a wonderful nonprofit organization that fosters the power of visual media in different ways through a variety of programs. But mostly through these fellowships. There’s global fellowships, and there’s local fellowships, the part where I’m working as in this new project called the California desk where there’s a group of small community newsrooms in California that really want to enhance the use of visuals. We collaborate with the six newsrooms and we help subsidize the salary for a full time visual journalists who are our fellows or catch light fellows that we have six new catch light fellows, this is a brand new thing that we’re experimenting with because of the decline of journalism, particularly visual journalism. There’s not a lot of jobs for visual journalists, not steady ones. It’s really difficult financially, emotionally, professionally, to be a visual journalist these days. So this project is kind of an experiment in trying to find a new model of how newsrooms can go back to really valuing the use of visuals and using it as a component of becoming close to your community. And my job is to work with these six fellows that are spread out throughout California in these different newsrooms, and I work with those newsrooms and I help them enhance use visuals. And I work with the fellows themselves, because a lot of times they’re the only or the first full time visual journalists that some of these publications have ever had. And so I’m there as a support, editor, coach to help them their assignments and, and just kind of help integrate that process into the newsroom. So

Mónika 04:58
What is the important for you of having visual journalists in the community? Why do you feel like that’s a critical role?

Mabel Jiménez  05:07
When you have somebody that understands a certain community, that’s part of it that knows the ins and outs, and the important events that happen locally, that person is going to be able to document with more nuance, is going to be able to gain greater access to different events and different moments that are significant to a given community. And I was working as a photo editor for El Tecolote newspaper a few years back, El Tecolote is a bilingual community newspaper in San Francisco covering the Latino community here in the Bay Area. I worked there as a photo editor for a few years. And one of the things we did was we started doing this photo exhibit where we would take the best photography from the newspaper from a given year, and then put it on gallery walls, print out the photos and these gorgeous prints, frame them and invite people to come in. And the first time we did that, we weren’t really necessarily sure how it was going to go. We did it the first year. And we were so surprised at just how many people came through and how many people wanted to see themselves because, you know, we have to talk about the fact that there’s been a lot of conversations around representation and improving representation of people of color, of marginalized people of all kinds in media in recent years. But there’s still a long way to go. And there’s still a way that mainstream media, whether it’s journalistic or entertainment wise still kind of ignores our stories, or bungles doesn’t do a great job of telling your stories. Having all these photographers in El Tecolote that were from the community and having you know them as documentarians reflect that back to the audience, to our readers to the people in the neighborhood. People were just so delighted to see a room full of journalistic documentation about their neighbors about themselves, things and people and events that they recognize. And it was so clear to see how people were excited to see themselves. And so we continued doing it for a few years while I worked there. And towards the last year that I worked at, El Tecolote we decided to do like a little booklet with the last several years of the best of the best of these photo exhibits, and from my time there as a photo editor, and we put this little compendium together, and we shared it with people. And one of the nicest things I heard somebody say was that this felt like a photo album, or like a family photo album of the neighborhood. And that was really kind of, I couldn’t have put it better myself. I wasn’t sure that I had that goal, you know, specifically, but to hear someone say like that. It really brought home how important it is for people to see themselves in media and journalism.

Mónika  08:04
That’s a role that I think only community, small local papers can fill. Right? And as they disappear, we’re losing those really local stories. So it’s where people see themselves in the news, right, that it’s not just the national news or the larger outlets. But what are the stories that are around us, right, that affect us? And who are the people that are there. Tell me a little bit about how your family reacted to you going into photography and photojournalism.

Mabel Jiménez  08:36
I think it took a while for them to kind of get it. Because, you know, I went to college and I got an education. And for many years I was really and this is a struggle of many journalists, particularly visual journalist, I did not have a steady paycheck. It was all very part time or freelancing, a lot of volunteering, and it was really, really hard to support myself. And so when you go from one country to another to try to have a better life, they’re like, why are you so broke all the time? Wow, did you have a college degree and you struggle so much to make a living. So I think it was hard for them to really be not being worried about me. And I think that’s a that’s the struggle of a lot of visual journalists. But it wasn’t, I think until they came to visit me they live down in San Diego and the first year that we did that photo exhibit at El Tecolote, they came to visit for that and that was the first time that they were seeing for themselves the impact of what I was doing. And so all these people you know, we’re in a room all these different artists and readers of El Tecolote and other journalists and photographers that I had worked with were there and so they really kind of got to see it and hear it for themselves why I cared so much and why I was so invested in what I was doing, even though it wasn’t providing me with steady livelihood, but it was something that was very important to me. And so it wasn’t until definitely a few years down the line that they were able to see like, Okay, I understand what she’s doing it now. But I think that probably a lot of immigrants or children of immigrants can kind of relate to that idea that your parents want you to pick something that’s very safe, like a doctor or a lawyer or these kinds of things. And then you become something that’s important and impactful, but riskier in terms of your livelihood, and stability. And so there’s, I think a lot of people have that struggle, but I think that they’ve come around in recent years.

Mónika  10:50
Tell us about one of the events or stories you covered while being at El Tecolote and what it meant to you.

Mabel Jiménez  10:58
Probably the one that affected me the most was when I went down to the border in 2019. In the middle of the Trump administration, and documented shelters where a lot of asylum seekers from Central America, were, you know, trying to make their way to the US. And I visited all these asylums where folks were staying in basically migratory limbo, not being able to enter the United States, because of the Remain in Mexico laws that the Trump administration enacted, and which you know, now, the Biden administration continues to enforce. I heard the stories directly of all the things that happen that make people have to leave the countries that they’re from all the different kinds of gang violence, transphobic violence that people have to flee. So I visited these refugees shel…refugee shelters basically. I visited someone who was in detention, I visited Friendship Park, the border where people on different sides of the border see each other. And it was just like, I don’t know, just honestly a lot of heart and difficulty seeing and processing that it said that I don’t have like this sort of positive, inspiring outcome. Like, I’m glad that I was the photos and the stories that I wrote from that had some circulation. And we’re in a few exhibits and a few conversations like open public conversations. But it’s somewhat discouraging that now that we have a different administration in office and democratic people who really made different kinds of promises about how immigration needs to be handled in this country have not made good on those promises. And there’s this sort of, I think, complacency now that because we don’t have this raging racist in the White House anymore, that the people aren’t out there on the streets anymore talking about these detainee camps at the border anymore. As we speak, they’re still kids, immigrant kids that are locked up on these detention centers. And now Biden is, you know, talking about closing Friendship Park in Tijuana, which is a meeting place where people who you know, maybe can’t visit each other’s countries, but can meet on different sides of the border. And now that’s going to be shut closed. And so all of this brutality and mishandling of immigrants and asylum seekers is not being talked about anymore. It was three years ago now that I went down there, and it still affects me, you know, I’m like reliving it, and it’s still it’s still raw, in a way. And it’s just like this issue is still happening. So I guess that is the story that’s affected me the most.

Mónika  13:42
Thank you for sharing that. And what do you feel like the role of visual journalists and specifically Latine photojournalists, visual journalists have in these moments, and community based visual journalists to be specific, because that’s your specialty.

Mabel Jiménez  14:00
When you can find a commonality with the people that you’re documenting, or the events that you’re documenting, you can come at it with more empathy, and more compassion, and more. I don’t know, photojournalism is definitely a medium that can also be used to objectify and exploit and misrepresent. So it’s definitely something that can be used for good and bad. Sometimes we see really impactful images, but we don’t know necessarily how that image was created. And what were the interactions involved between the photographer and the person that is being photographed. And sometimes we can look at a really great photograph and not realize that maybe the person didn’t consent to it. You know, maybe the person doesn’t know how the spread of this image is going to follow them later on in their life. If someone were to take a picture of you during the one of the worst, most difficult moments of your life and years later, you know, you look up your name online, and this same story keeps coming up, like how would that affect the person and that’s the reality that you have a privilege of having access to being able to see some of these historical events, front row seats to history, but there’s also a lot of responsibility that really needs to be thought about. And I think that having a relationship, it’s not always possible, right. Like when I went to the border, I documented a lot of people that are not from the same place that I’m from that I’ve never met before. You know, I’m a Latina, living in San Francisco, relatively privileged, comfortable life. And I’m going even though I also transitioned from Mexico to the US, my experience was very much different than than the people that I was documenting in 2019. But I can find a lot of commonalities, we speak the same language, we can understand a lot of the same cultural spirit that that can sort of help bridge the differences. And it’s not always possible to only document your own community or your own neighborhood, it’s certainly an ideal scenario, but look sort of closer that you can get a person that has an understanding of what someone else is experiencing, the better documentation that you’re going to have, I think and the more not just better documentation in the sense of making good images or making impactful images, but also in the sense of, how do we treat the people that we’re documenting and how are they impacted? I think that when I went to journalism school and took all these photojournalism classes, there was a lot of conversations about how to get access, how to get a good photo, et cetera, how to, you know, tell a story with it. But honestly, there was not a ton of conversations about how do you treat people? And how do you empathize that I think that we had, like one ethics class, one semester of ethics class that barely scratched the surface, but and I think that 2020 has started like a paradigm shift on how will we relate to ourselves and to each other and a desire, I think, for more empathy, and treating each other with gentleness. And I think that storytelling is and journalism is also having conversations about that. And one interesting conversation that’s being had is the role of objectivity and neutrality, which basically tells you that there should be a separation between you and your subject, almost it like you shouldn’t care, you shouldn’t be involved too much. And that’s been the sort of ethical standard that’s been you know, drilled in, you know, for the last 100 years of photojournalism and journalistic practice in general. And that’s something that’s really being reexamined. Like, why do we have to be so separate?

Mabel Jiménez  17:50
And I have to say, like, when I was in Tijuana, and reporting down at the border there, I did a lot of things that a lot of people that are in this traditional objective tradition, were really frowned upon. Like I took donations, I collected a bunch of donations in San Francisco, and I put them in a van and drove them down there and distributed them to the shelters where people were staying. And that’s, you know, the traditional way, that’s a big no, no, you’re not supposed to change things or, you know, get involved in that way. And I certainly got some criticism. And then when I came back, I organized a protest outside of the ICE building in San Francisco, I organized the protest of journalists against detention camps, we can’t be neutral about having children locked up in detention camps, like how are you neutral to something like that? That’s something that in the traditional sense, a lot of other publications, mainstream publications would not allow their journalists to do that would even fire you for doing something like that. Luckily, I was working at El Tecolote newspaper where we definitely have an opinion about these things. And we were proud to represent ourselves against these things that were happening, they’re still happening at the border.

Mónika  19:08
The tension of objectivity. The tensions between how are you both a community journalist who’s deeply connected to your community and can tell stories only because you are connected, and this think, you know, very sterile view of objectivity. Right? That is, in fact, people can question I question other people question right? Can you actually be that objective, right? You always bring yourself to your work in one way or another. So it’s interesting to hear you. There’s sort of a double protests and protests of what you were seeing and also the protests of journalists as it stands.

Mabel Jiménez  19:52
True. I had not seen it as as a protest against this rigid objectivity there. But I guess Yeah, that’s what we were doing too.

Musical Break  20:01

Mabel Jiménez  20:01
Having been challenged so much, and working at a newspaper that, you know, when you have an opinion as we did, sometimes the greater mainstream gatekeepers will call you things like you’re an advocate newspaper, or you’re an activist newspaper. And that is supposed to be an insult. But it’s, you know, definitely something that’s used to de-legitimize what we do, and it’s something that is used against those. And now that the conversation is really interesting now to see the last couple of years the conversation turning to, you know, maybe objectivity isn’t the end all be all of this and taking on the practices that a lot of community media and ethnic media have been sort of harping on for decades and saying, No, it’s okay to be an advocate for your community, it’s okay to notice things and say, Hey, we don’t have services here, hey, our community is not served in the same way as other communities. And that’s not okay. And that to say things like that makes you not objective, like you’re not supposed to care. But I think it’s hopefully like a facade, that we’re all get to drop pretty soon, because we’re human beings, we have experiences, we have opinions, and we cannot remove ourselves from them as we go on about our work. I think that that’s one way that you know, being Latina has impacted how I approach this whole thing.

Mónika  21:40
What I’m hearing is that when you’re focusing your lens somewhere, it’s to speak to the needs of the community. It’s saying, I’m connected to this community, I understand the needs of this community. And I’m going to use my lens to show you what is happening here. I’m going to bring you into it, even if you cannot get into it, right because you don’t have access because of your geography, identities, whatever it may be, desire. But here I am as a photojournalist, as a visual journalist saying, Look here, there is beauty, there’s need, there’s joy, there’s heartache, and I can show you, that is what I’m hearing you say.

Mabel Jiménez  22:22
Yeah, definitely.

Mónika  22:23
Are there other ways that you feel like your identities as a Latina, and please bring forth any other identities that you hold that you would like to share that you feel that your identity has affected how you approach your work as a photojournalist, as an editor now as a mentor to other visual journalist.

Mabel Jiménez  22:43
As far as my identity, I’m Latina, I grew up in Mexico, I’m a Mexicana, who grew up in Tijuana, who grew up at the border. And to me being a border Mexican is a very like particular type of existence, because you really kind of see the interaction between these two countries, and these two forces. The power dynamics of all of that it’s something that you kind of have present from a very early age, when I started studying, like going to college and taking photography and journalism classes, I wasn’t in a particularly diverse part of the US. So there wasn’t a lot of people that looked like me that had my cultural understanding that I could sort of look to or look up to and bond with, I had some great mentors. Definitely. And I don’t have any complaints, you know, they had some really great mentors, actually. And they were all you know, older white males who were either like college professors, or supervisors and certain jobs that I had, who really, really supported me in really beautiful ways. But I definitely wonder sometimes, like, what, what it might have looked like what my journey might have looked like if one of my mentors would have been another Latina, for example, that helped me understand how to navigate things. Because, you know, when I was coming up, and just starting to kind of dabble in this almost 20 years ago now, like, again, there wasn’t a lot of other Latinos around me doing this. And so I could share in the experience of being a photographer or being a journalist, but there was a lot of parts of my experience that I just couldn’t really bring or integrate in a way that other people would understand the stuff that was challenging and I think that definitely shaped the way that I see myself in the industry. I don’t know that it necessarily, I don’t know how it would shaped my creative process, but I think it definitely shaped an impact how I moved in that world. And for me, that meant kind of being a little intimidated and or afraid or I don’t know how to call it to kind of reach out and try to be a journalist or try to be a part of these larger institutions. And so for me, finding El Tecolote newspaper was kind of like my safe space. And working in ethnic media, community media, but particularly ethnic media is it’s like being in this parallel universe that’s kind of invisible to a lot of people, we may not have as big reach as something like the New York Times or something. But we know that this neighborhood that we are able to reach the weekend actually talk to them directly, even though I kind of felt like I couldn’t access other spaces. El Tecolote was really the place that I was able to just grow and be surrounded by other Latinos and other people of color, and other people from all over the place. And from all kinds of backgrounds. That was great. But at the same time, I also kept thinking of myself as a sort of outsider.

Mabel Jiménez  25:54
It hasn’t been until very recently, first with this COVID documentation project that the city of San Francisco and the SF Arts commission invited me to document an aspect of the impact of COVID on the city, late 2020 is when the city the SF Arts commission put together this art residency program, that meant giving four artists access to the city’s COVID command center, and be able to witness all those operations and how all these different city agencies interacted to respond to the to the pandemic. And so there was four of us two photographers and two illustrators, we were given access to the COVID command center. And what that meant was this big office Think Tank space in Moscone Center in San Francisco. But it also meant access to testing sites, vaccination sites, and other different kinds of services that the city was providing. We were given pretty much creative freedom as to you know, given that access, what did we want to focus on, and I really struggled with figuring out what I should focus on. And it’s, you know, now looking back on it, I feel kind of silly that I didn’t see what was in front of me all along. Because my training as a journalist has been, don’t document the people closest to you. And I was also surprised that as a journalist, I was invited to do an art residency. And I should say, I don’t think of myself as an artist, because I think artists create and bring new things into the world. And as a documentarian, I don’t feel that I’m creating anything, I feel that I’m documenting the things that are there that I’m saving people’s memories, and I’m helping us collectively hold on to other things that people have created. But I don’t see myself as a creative or as an artist. So I was kind of by being in this art space or invited by the Arts Commission, I for kind of forgot that there wasn’t this rigid expectation, in the same way that I had to proceed with this expectation of separation of objectivity and neutrality of not documenting the people that are closest to you. But it was really Meg Shiffler, who was then the director of galleries, and who is the one that invited me to this art residence. She’s the one who said, you know, it’s okay, like, this is an art project, really, you know, it doesn’t have to be journalistic.

Mabel Jiménez  28:25
And in the end, I did end up approaching and as a journalist, but I felt so much more comfortable in documenting people that I knew because a lot of the people in the volunteering at a lot of these testing sites and food distribution sites, things like that were people that I knew that I had met throughout the years before when I worked at El Tecolote. So all of these connections and people that I met documenting the neighborhood, when I first came to San Francisco as a student, all that those years at El Tecolote, you know, I wasn’t part of the community. When I first got here, I didn’t know anybody. And it was through El Tecolote, that I really started developing those relationships that by the time we got to this art residency a few years down the road now I really knew these people. Now a lot of them had become my friends always giving credit back to Meg Shiffler that told me you know, I know that this is not what they told you to do in journalism school, but I think that your project will feel a lot more personal and more significant if you are working with people that you know, and in fact, that did help me gain access to these places. I mean, I had even if an institution like the in this case, the SF Department of Public Health, gave me a vest and like clipboard, and like photo release forums with their logo that made me legit in accessing a vaccination site for example, it’s one thing to get that authorization from these government institutions to enter that space is a different thing to actually be accepted and actually make people feel comfortable. There’s no like stamp of approval that’s gonna do that for you. So it’s like, okay, I got the the entrance access from them. But once I stepped through the door, I knew a lot of those people. And it was like this immediate Oh, hey, Mabel, how are you doing? And that was so much different than you know, at one point, I did try to photograph COVID testing site that was in Chinatown. And people were, you know, lovely and welcoming to me. But I don’t speak Cantonese or Mandarin, I can’t convey what this project is about. I can’t make those connections. And so that’s not my role to take there. That’s for a documentarian in that community to approach and to support the fact that I would come through the door that I can speak Spanish, and I can speak the language of all the folks and the Mission that people already know me that people that are managing volunteers already know me and can trust me, the moment that I walk through the door, I know that I have their trust, and it’s reciprocal, right, they trust me, and I trust them that made it really special.

Mabel Jiménez  31:06
And now I can sort of look back on this document, I took these photos, and I printed them out. And still in the process of putting together the final digital entry for the SF Library. So if you go to the SF Library, at the very top floor, there’s all this historic documentation. And those photos have become part of that, during this pandemic, a lot of us look at photos and documentation of another big pandemic 100 years ago, you know, I’m hoping that if something else like this happens, I’d like to say I hope another pandemic doesn’t happen, but more likely it will. And when people look back and be like, Well, how did my mother or grandmother or grandparents or ancestors approach this, that folks in San Francisco will be able to look back at these things and how the community how the Latino community here face that, that’s something that would not have been possible, if I hadn’t spent 10 plus years at El Tecolote, getting to know these communities, I always have to give credit to them, no matter what I do and where I go.

Mónika  32:09
What was the personal impact for you of being so such an intimate space with how the Latino community in San Francisco was affected and impacted? Which was rather a large impact, being in the area of myself understanding that there was a very substantial impact on the Latino community in San Francisco? What how did that affect you personally, to see that through your lens?

Mabel Jiménez  32:34
It actually gave me a lot of hope. I mean, things were and are still pretty dire, particularly for for Black folks, for Brown, folks, as far as the impact of COVID. Whether we’re talking about rates of infection, or we’re talking about economic impact, it definitely has to be recognized that certain communities were impacted harder than others. And especially in the early times of the pandemic, before we all had access to, you know, at home tests, and before there was a vaccine, those first couple of months in the pandemic, were really, really rough for Latinos in San Francisco. In the city of San Francisco, Latinos make up about 15% of the population. So that’s not a whole lot anymore. For many, many months during the pandemic, they made up 50% of infections. So for a group that’s 15% of the city to actually be half or more of the infections, is really tells you the inequalities there and access to health and access to jobs that allow you to work from home. So that was really rough. Like just reading the statistics and seeing how that community was more effective, more impact, it was really painful, but actually starting to document it, how people were working against this and fighting the pandemic gave me so much hope. Because all these sites, whether it was a testing site, or food site, like like people actually giving food away for free to people who are struggling, the volunteers always had like such an amazing spirit. And with everything happening, it was hard not to feel happy around these folks. And sometimes they would be playing music and making jokes and just, you know, having the time of their lives while they’re directing a testing site or helping people sign up for vaccinations or whatever it was or you know, boxing up groceries to give away. There was always just the spirit of togetherness and just wanting to help each other. So it just gave me a lot of hope. And it made me feel better that even though a lot of larger institutions, were not giving this community the resources that it needed. This community is very self reliant and it didn’t wait, you know, to get rescued it really even, you know, with all these challenges against us. A lot of my friends and neighbors really, really stood up and did the right thing. A lot of folks who didn’t have anything who lost everything themselves, or some of the first ones that were signing up to help others. And so that really just restored my faith in humanity a little bit.

Mónika  35:11
What do you see as the future of community photojournalism and visual journalism?

Mabel Jiménez  35:19
It’s really hard to say right now, because I feel like we’re going through this big paradigm shift kind of moment where we’re all re examining what our roles are. But I feel that a lot of the structures that have been dictating how journalism and documentation should happen are really being torn down. And a lot of the assumptions that we had about how we’re supposed to do our work, are being questioned and torn down. I feel like for the longest time to think about what a photojournalist is sometimes invokes images of like, you know, honestly, like White dudes going to exotic countries and exploring the world through their lens and as a way of exploring something that’s maybe very foreign to you. And I can definitely see why a vision like that is romanticized. And even if you’re not a White dude, whoever you are just this idea of like, yeah, I want to travel the world and take photographs. And there’s definitely like, who wouldn’t want to do that? But when you’re really thinking about the impact of like, Why should I tell this or that story versus anybody else, and you really have to think about what is my place in the world, and where’s the place that I can best be of support or where I can best contribute, and where I can actually make a difference. And when we’re having folks outsourcing work, or a lot of international news organizations still, to this day, will instead of like finding a photographer in the places that they want to report in the countries that they want to report, they take one of their freelancers, usually American or European or something like that from a heavily colonized country and send them to these other countries. And it’s just like this automatic thing. This idea of exploring new places through your lens, I mean, it’s fine and great if you’re a tourist or something like that, you can do that. But if you’re like a journalist, and you’re trying to have that first crack of writing history, that’s maybe not the role that we should be taking with that. And then we should really have an intimate insight or understanding of different communities in history as part of our documentation.

Mabel Jiménez  37:31
And I think that’s, that’s the strength of you know, to get back to your question about community media and community journalism, I think it’s really going to go back to that. I think that when you’re starting out, as a journalist, there’s always these aspirational places that people always want to work and the big names that kind of signal, how successful you might be in your career journey to be able to say, I work at the New York Times, Reuters, National Geographic, all these really amazing places. And I know people who work at these places, and I’m so proud and glad for them. But that’s not the only destination, right? That’s not the only place where we can make an impact. And right now, I feel that the thought is that a lot of journalists see community media as a stepping stone right into these other bigger names and places and organizations. And I want to see community media become not a stepping stone to something else. But like a destination where you can be and you can stay and you can build a career, I really think that the future media has to be supporting our community media, there’s a crisis where newspapers are closing, but most of us wherever we live, there’s there’s something like there’s something publishing somewhere. And so you know, wherever you live, you can look up what’s the nearest small community newsroom and subscribe to it. Whether you’re subscribing to an online newsletter, or you’re subscribing to a paper that actually gets delivered to you just find a way to support that because that’s really having an informed community and informed city that can vote and you know, look up after our own interests, like that’s the first step is being informed.

Mónika  39:12
Yes to all of that, what does it mean to you to have been called La Fotógrafa del Pueblo?

Mabel Jiménez  39:18
That’s the biggest honor. That’s the best award. Yeah, I mean, that’s, that’s something that I noticed in the past years, and again, like I did not grow up in the mission. I grew up in Mexico, and I came here and been here a few years now. And again, I didn’t know anybody at first. When I first came here, so going through El Tecolote, being able to meet so many people and to gain their trust to a point where I see people calling me that it just kind of really touches my heart because like that’s exactly what I would hope that people trust me.

Mónika  39:55
Tell me a little bit about how you approach image making.

Mabel Jiménez  39:59
I don’t think of myself as someone who’s like making or creating something, but I do try to approach it, you know, with with respect, I think that you just have to be very respectful and not just thinking about it as this is my story. And this is my project, but really how the way that you occupy a space affects what’s going on around you. Are people uncomfortable when I pull out my camera? Like, are they self conscious, you know, if they see like a press pass around my neck and so so I think it’s just really trying to put yourself in the minds of the people that you’re documenting, which sounds obvious, but I think is really easy to forget, just trying to make those connections is really important.

Mónika  40:40
Is there an aspect of photography that continues to challenge you and that you continue to develop your skills in?

Mabel Jiménez  40:48
I think that part is always going to be like that introversion and social anxiety factor, it really varies on the situation, you know, there’s moments where if I’m photographing, like a, say, a portrait and or is this like a, like an artist, for example, in their studio, and it’s this very kind of intimate situation, that’s a little bit easier to handle like a one on one situation or a small group. But when it’s something that’s more open and unpredictable, and less controllable, like a protest or big art festival or something like that, it’s you know, how to approach people in a way that you want to get consent, you want to make sure that it’s okay for people to be photographed. But at the same time, how do you check in with someone without interrupting the moment that you’re trying to photograph? And so that’s always like a very instinctual thing like that you have to deal with as it comes, right? If I tap someone on the shoulder, and I say, Hey, can I take this photo? Am I already interrupting them? And you know, ending the moment that I was trying to photograph? How do you balance that? Do you take a photo first and then check in sometimes you just check in with eye contact, and you can sort of get the sense that people are okay with you documenting. So that’s something that never goes away that you kind of have to constantly be navigating? There’s no instruction manual for that one.

Mónika  42:15
What’s the one thing that still excites you about your craft?

Mabel Jiménez  42:19
Seeing the way that people are rethinking a lot of these concepts of how documentarian should move around the world? I think for for myself, and many of us that are starting in our careers, a lot of the focus is, how do I take good photos? How do I make good images? And I think now these conversations are shifting to, Okay, forget about whether my photos are good or bad, or whatever, you know, like how are the affordance like impacting the people in the communities that that a document being documented that people that are seeing these images right are also impacted in a different way. There’s just a lot of, you know, patterns that are that are being re-shifted. There’s one photographer in particular, whose work I really admire. His name is Josue Rivas, who will absolutely respect his work as a photographer. But in addition to that, what really draws me to him is all the different thoughts that he’s bringing forth. And I really recommend that folks follow him his handle on Instagram is hostway Josue underscore foto with an F. So, @josue_foto, and he’s this indigenous photographer who’s really really, really supporting the representation of indigenous folks and both sides of the lens as documentarians and as well as people who are documented and have their stories told, and he’s just bringing so many different interesting concepts to the conversation.

Mabel Jiménez  43:53
And one thing he posted about recently was about the language that we use to describe a lot of the photographic process and how that language kind of can reinforce a lot of the colonial concepts you could say that are sometimes behind photography. Because as we were saying earlier, like photography and journalism can also be a tool to reinforce colonialism and oppression and you know, things like saying shoot make your camera is a reference to a weapon, you know, and certainly images and photography can be used to hurt others and so it matters how we think about these things and language shapes the way we think and so if we think about our photography as something where we’re constantly taking, capturing, shooting it has like a very just all these implications in terms of the power dynamic or calling someone a subject like I’m hearing more people that refuse to call or use the word subjects when referring to the people that they photograph because what this is subject mean right like it implies this certain power dynamic that We really should be questioning. And so when we use this language, and I, myself, I’m sure I’m going to be, I’m going to have to check myself and I’m gonna keep saying these things, but I am trying to think about things in a different way.

Mabel Jiménez  45:14
And so all these new paradigm shifts and thought, but also technology, all the things that are coming up, you know, virtual reality. And yeah, is like, that’s the part that excites me, like all these different things that we can do with technology, 360 cameras, you know, it’s like, drones that help us, you know, can be also used for bad, but they can also help us see and access places that sometimes you can’t access with your human body, then you can get literally a new different perspective on the world. So obviously, a lot of these things as new things all have potential for, for good and bad, but I’m, I’m excited for what you know, especially how the next generation, the really young, the Gen Z folks that are coming up that haven’t been as reinforced in the way that people of my generation were, you know, reinforced with certain concepts. I really like having my my role at CatchLight. Because I get to work with these young folks that are just coming up and seeing all the new approaches that they bring. And that keeps me on my toes, and keeps me from being complacent.

Mónika  46:21
I’m really curious, you know, now you’re mentoring younger photographers, what would you tell yourself as a younger photographer, like knowing the things, you know, now, if you could go back and speak to your younger self as a photographer, what would you tell her?

Mabel Jiménez  46:35
I think that I was slowed down a lot by like insecurity and fear, and just wondering if my work was good enough and never feeling like I was ready to knock on certain doors or to show off my work. And so if I could go back, I would definitely encourage my past self to share my work more, but just put my myself out there and not wait for things to happen to me, but to really take a more proactive role. And a lot of it came from my own feelings of am I good enough? Am I worth it. And I would just say like, even if you don’t think you’re quite ready, or whatever, like, you just don’t know how other people are going to see your work. And so, you know, to just not be afraid to put your work out there and share it and use these tools that are available to you now, because editors aren’t going to come to you, you know, curators or kind of come to you, you have to really put yourself out there and make yourself vulnerable. But it’s sometimes the only way.

Mónika  47:40
Where do you see yourself going as a photographer, as an editor, as an educator, you’ve been all of these roles, where do you see yourself going?

Mabel Jiménez  47:43
I’m really enjoying my my job at CatchLight right now. Because for the first time, I’m just meeting people from all over the place and organizations and institutions that I didn’t even know existed, whether in, you know, big, well known institutions, but also people that are working at the community level, all over the country, and how you know, those struggles can relate to each other. That’s been really exciting. And so I feel like I’m kind of been taking a pause a little bit from my own photography work. And it’s kind of inevitable as an editor full time, but I’m okay with that. Because it’s giving me just an opportunity to really get a bigger lay of the land. From a perspective that I’d never had before or had access to before I am working on a book, about this COVID documentation that I was doing earlier this year, I got approved for an artist grant from SF Arts Commission, supporting my work once again, then so grateful for that. I’m going to start working on pretty soon taking these photos that I had been taking this earlier part of the pandemic and I’m making it into this cohesive narrative and you know, interviewing folks, so I’m not super sure like I am liking working at CatchLight. So I’m intending to continue there for a long time. But one thing that pandemic has taught me is just how certain things can be and plans can change.

Mónika  49:17
All of that is very exciting. I’m so excited about your book. Congratulations. What a beautiful document of the community during this time. Where can people find you like we want to look at your work many people are listening to this where can they find your work?

Mabel Jiménez  49:34
Mabeljimenez.com and Instagram @mabeljmnz I keep a little bit more up to date. Check out the work that CatchLight is doing as well and sign up for the newsletter catchlight.io and just really just stay in the know not just what Catchlight is doing but what a lot of other photography and media organizations are doing.

Mónika  49:53
Thank you so much Mabel, it is always a pleasure to talk to you.

Mabel Jiménez  49:57
Same here. I’m so glad you know that you’re doing all this work with Our Latina Lens. It is definitely something that was very much missing and needed and I’m so excited even you know filling this very important need of us like talking to each other and creating communities that did not exist you know when you and I were first dabbling in photography so I’m so excited that you’re doing this.

Mónika  50:21
Gracias for all your support.

Mónika  50:23
(music) In our next episode Mabel will take us behind the scenes of her photograph as she captured a “pinkie kiss” at Friendship Park, which spans San Diego and Tijuana, where families often come to travel to reconnect through this tiny bit of cross border contact. Then she will take us to the community farewell of a multi generational mural in San Francisco’s Mission neighborhood that symbolizes the larger transition and process of mourning losses caused by gentrification and the pandemic. Visit ourlatinalens.com to see shownotes, read the transcript, see the bios of our guests and sign up for our newsletter.

Mónika  51:09
This episode was created, produced and hosted by me, Monika Aldarondo Lugo. Our cover art was designed by Tumpa Mistry, and our theme song composed and recorded by Mattijs Muller.

Mónika  51:30
(music) Laancla Creative